B-Line terminating at Newport won’t work: Community Residents Groups Alternative Solution
July 28, 2017 – from CABPRA (Clareville and Bilgola Plateau Residents Association), NRA (Newport Residents Association), PBWBA (The Palm Beach & Whale Beach Association), and APA (Avalon Preservation Association)This week the major community groups north of Mona Vale met with the planners of the B-Line to discuss a better public transport solution north of Mona Vale.
“Having the B-Line terminating in Newport won’t work for most of us living north of Mona Vale,” says David Owen, President of CABPRA (Clareville and Bilgola Plateau Residents Association).
“We could also feel the frustration from the B-Line planners, as it appears their hands are tied to a Newport solution. They have looked at nine ideas for turning the buses in Newport – none seem to work. All are destructive for the village.
“It is clear that the Newport solution is a political idea which makes no sense on so many level. It is obvious that the ramifications hadn’t been thought through,” Mr Owen adds.
Gavin Butler, President of the Newport Residents Association stated after the meeting,
"The project team offered nothing in the way of addressing the service concerns raised in a joint submission from these community groups. The project team only tried to justify their proposals.
" They have not finalised a new timetable as yet and will not seek community feedback before they publish it. They remain intent on taking the B-Line to Newport."
The Project Team attempted to justify Newport by saying their future demand study for the next 10 years suggested 60% of the demand at Mona Vale would be from the North and 40% from the West. This was a new answer completely at odds with those previously given whereby their initial economic assessment had Mona Vale as the start point.
Points from the Meeting
- The Project Team stated they intend to dedicate up to 70 car spaces at the Newport Surf Club as permanent commuter spots but did not define how that would work
- The Project Team defined a bus ‘Terminus’ as where a service finishes or commence from (and where staff can take a break)
- The Project Team are still looking at 9 different terminus options at Newport including the streets to the west of Barrenjoey Road
- The Project Team have no knowledge of the Mona Vale depot ever being considered as a terminus/commuter parking station
- The Project Team confirmed that there would be no through city services covering the ‘Newport Loop’ during peak hours (there are currently 14 between 6 & 8am weekdays).
" In summary Tspt. for NSW have made up their minds about the proposed service schedule they have come up with and are not prepared to deviate. They have not disclosed the Opal data they say are driving their decisions, to validate their position.
" With regard to the effect of the B-Line terminus at Newport we have no further detail to be able to assess the real impact and so at this stage it remains a real concern regarding the impact on the Surf Club Carpark and/or the residential streets around Newport." Mr Butler said.
Richard West AM, President of the Palm Beach & Whale Beach Association reiterated his earlier statement of plans to cut L90 services.
"It is of particular concern that after 3 p.m. commuters will have to change to the proposed new '199' from Manly. This will add at least half an hour to the already longest commuter bus service in Sydney. If this proposal is followed, the government will be spending half a billion dollars on a service which will be worse than the current one for Newport, Avalon, Palm Beach and Whale Beach residents.
" We expect a better express service to town at all times. The Peninsula ends at Palm Beach, not at Newport or Mona Vale. The residents of Avalon, Palm Beach and Whale Beach will be placed in considerable disadvantage should this proposal to end L90 services be adopted."
Over the last year CABPRA has been working with the Avalon Preservation Association, Newport Residents Association and Palm Beach & Whale Beach Association to come up with a better public transport solution.
“Together we have talked with more than 400 residents. We have canvased people on bus stops, on the buses and in our local communities. It is clear that people want and need express buses into Sydney CBD where many work and play. They also want stops at major interchanges to add flexibility.”
The solution the groups have come up with is simple. Three express bus routes which go into Sydney CBD, all stops to Mona Vale, then stopping Warriewood, Warringah Mall and Neutral Bay only. They will go throughout the day and run more frequently at peak times (see below for more detail) :
- An ‘E90’ running Palm Beach to the city
- An ‘E89’ running around the Clareville/Bilgola Plateau route into Avalon and then to the city
- An ‘E88’ running around Careel Bay into Avalon and then into the city
“What we need now is the ability to work with B-Line planners to nut out the fine details on this solution without being tied to an unworkable Newport B-Line Terminus solution.”
Bus services suggestions north of Mona Vale
Aims/Goal
- A bus stop within about 10mins walking time of most homes
- Buses get to their destination by about an hour
- Have no buses terminating in our village centres
- Take pressure off Mona Vale B-Line service – make it more reliable, less congested
- Not to turn Avalon, Newport or Mona Vale into carparks - a public transport which relies on ‘park-and ride’ is a bad system
- No bus changes if you are going into Sydney CBD - each time you change adds at least 10 minutes to your trip (some cases it could add up to an hour or even leave you stranded)
- Have each bus route as simple as possible - i.e. it shouldn't change depending on the time of day. It shouldn't sometimes terminate in Avalon, sometimes in Palm Beach. It shouldn’t terminate sometimes in MV, sometimes in Newport.
- Limit buses on our narrowest of streets – this causes delays as buses have to squeeze down these streets.
Community groups north of Mona Vale solution:
• Have an “E90”, a new bus, which goes around Palm Beach area. It should go all stops into MV then stopping only at Warriewood, Warringah Mall Junction, Neutral Bay Junction and the City. This should go every 20 minutes in offpeak and every 15 minutes in peak times.- Set-down only Warriewood, Warringah Mall and Neutral Bay Junction after Mona Vale going into the city
- Pick-up only at Neutral Bay, Warringah Mall and Warriewood Junction before Mona Vale going towards Avalon.
• Have an “E88”, a normal size new bus, which goes around Careel Bay area via Avalon. This route should not go down Central Road but Avalon Pde. instead. It should go every half-hour throughout the day all stops into MV then stopping only at Warriewood, Warringah Mall Junction, Neutral Bay Junction and the City.
- Set-down only Warriewood, Warringah Mall and Neutral Bay Junction after Mona Vale going into the city
- Pick-up only at Neutral Bay, Warringah Mall and Warriewood Junction before Mona Vale going towards Avalon.
• Have an “E89”, a normal size new bus, which goes around Clareville/Bilgola area via Avalon (see map for more detail) every half-hour in throughout the day all stops into MV then stopping only at Warriewood, Warringah Mall Junction, Neutral Bay Junction and the City.
- Set-down only Warriewood, Warringah Mall and Neutral Bay Junction after Mona Vale going into the city
- Pick-up only at Neutral Bay, Warringah Mall and Warriewood Junction before Mona Vale going towards Avalon.
• One of the above routes needs to go around the “Newport Arms” route to collect West Newport residents. The other two should go the more direct route along Barrenjoey Road.
• The 199 Manly to Palm Beach bus is a “nice-to-have” service. However it is of the lowest priority. It should not take priority or replace a direct service into the city.
CABPRA worked with the Avalon Preservation Association, Newport Residents Association and Palm Beach & Whale Beach Association to come up with this solution. Together they have talked with more than 400 residents.
At a Glance
Palm Beach at a glanceAn express bus, for simplicity lets call it the ‘E90’, will travel to Mona Vale. In peak hours, timing of these buses will be every 15 minutes, in off-peak every 20 minutes. After Mona Vale they will:
- Set-down only Warriewood, Warringah Mall and Neutral Bay Junction after Mona Vale going into the city
- Pick-up only at Neutral Bay, Warringah Mall and Warriewood Junction before Mona Vale going towards Palm Beach.
Palm Beach will also have the ‘199’ to Manly.
Careel Bay at a glance
An express bus, for simplicity lets call it the ‘E88’, will travel the existing 192 bus route but with the change of going down Avalon Parade rather than Central Road (see map). The reason for this is that Central is becoming too congested for buses. It will also mean the elimination of the bus stop in Old Barrenjoey Road.
From Avalon this bus will then travel to Mona Vale, i.e. i. This bus will go every 30 minutes throughout the day.
After Mona Vale they will:
- Set-down only Warriewood, Warringah Mall and Neutral Bay Junction after Mona Vale going into the city
- Pick-up only at Neutral Bay, Warringah Mall and Warriewood Junction before Mona Vale going towards Avalon.
Clareville & Bilgola Plateau at a glance
An express bus, for simplicity lets call it the ‘E89’, will travel a similar route to the existing 191 (see map).
However we need to cut out the Argyle Street and Raymond Terrace loop as it is too congested for buses.
From Avalon this bus will then travel the existing E88 route to Mona Vale. This bus will go every 20 minutes in peak hours and every 30 minutes
throughout the day.
After Mona Vale they will:
- Set-down only Warriewood, Warringah Mall and Neutral Bay Junction after Mona Vale going into the city
- Pick-up only at Neutral Bay, Warringah Mall and Warriewood Junction before Mona Vale going towards Avalon.
Also with these proposed E88 and E89 bus routes, there will be no need for the 191 or the 192.
This will cut down on the number of buses through Avalon. It will also mean we no longer need the bus stops in the centre of Avalon. They can be relegated to the edge of the village (see map).
This will cut down on the number of buses through Avalon. It will also mean we no longer need the bus stops in the centre of Avalon. They can be relegated to the edge of the village (see map).
Avalon at a glance
In peak-hour Avalon will have:
• nine ‘E’ buses going into the city each hour.
• ‘199 buses’ from Palm Beach to Manly.
In off-peak Avalon will have:
• seven ‘E’ buses going into the city each hour.
• ‘199 buses’ from Palm Beach to Manly.
Buses will not stop in the centre of the village, only on the edge. This eliminates the two existing bus stops in the village freeing the area up for other use. Plus buses will no longer need to turn at the Old Barrenjoey and Barrenjoey Roads intersection.
Newport at a glance
In peak-hour Newport will have:
• nine ‘E’ buses going into the city each hour.
• ‘199 buses’ from Palm Beach to Manly.
In off-peak Newport will have:
• seven ‘E’ buses going into the city each hour.
• ‘199 buses’ from Palm Beach to Manly.
Mona Vale at a glance
The B-line should terminate at Mona Vale. It is a natural transport hub, going further to Newport makes no sense and will be costly.
Build the B-Line terminus at Mona Vale bus depot (see illustration), as suggested by the Mona Vale Residents Association. Transport NSW can build a carpark there, maybe a coffee shop. There will be toilets. It can ensure the carpark is for users of the B-Line only, if it wants. It will be a secure and safe stop for passengers getting on and off at night. Plus it is right opposite one of the major shopping centres in Mona Vale.
If you plan a proper bus service for people north of Mona Vale, this will take pressure off the B-Line from Mona Vale. It will make it quicker, less congested. It could also mean less buses on our roads. It will definitely mean less buses terminating and turning in our villages. Plus less need for expensive, ugly car-parks.
Final suggestion
Some money saved by not having the B-Line going to Newport could be spent on putting in safety footpaths along these bus routes where they are desperately needed, making it safer for users to walk to the bus stops.
Compiled in conjunction with all residential community groups north of Mona Vale:
• CABPRA (Clareville and Bilgola Plateau Residents Association)
• PBWBA (The Palm Beach & Whale Beach Association)
• APA (Avalon Preservation Association)
• NRA (Newport Residents Association)